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graphime | on: Apple decided not to roll out Siri in EU after denied request for exemption
Good.

EU has the right to privacy.

Apple also has the right to not conduct business in EU.

If EU doesn’t like it, they can build their own sovereign software.

woah | parent | next
I believe that the issue was that the EU wanted Apple to open up their new AI agent interface (the ability to control every app on your phone so Siri can call you an Uber or whatever), and Apple thought that it was too risky of a capability to give to any random AI app right out of the gate.
esperent | root | parent
> Apple thought that it was too risky of a capability to give to any random AI app right out of the gate

Oh come on. Apple doesn't want to give up control. That's what this is about. The privacy thing is just to make them look good

y1n0 | root | parent | next
Nothing you wrote is in disagreement with the parent.
m3kw9 | root | parent
It's both but the dangers are far more issue for their brand than control
happyopossum | parent | next
> EU has the right to privacy.

Sure - the DMA has nothing to do with privacy though, so that's a straw man. or is it a red herring? I always get those confused.

frizlab | parent | next
EU does not want privacy. They actually want to get rid of privacy every so often (adding backdoors in encrypted conversations). So far it has not worked out, but I’m afraid they will succeed at one point.

To follow along that line of thoughts, the requirements they are actually asking for proper DMA compliance would probably go right in that direction tbh.

I, for one, am happy Apple is taking a stance, and, as an European would really much like my government to stop asking ridiculous things that do not profit the consumer.

FinnKuhn | parent | next
This doesn't have anything to do with privacy.

The DMA mandates that Apple allows for competition, which (if you believe in capitalism) is good for the market overall. It's essential to stop big tech from abusing their market dominance. However Apple would prefer to not allow competition for their digital products on any of their hardware.

bnj | root | parent | next
But that does have to do with privacy.

Apple wants to implement features that access data locally. It doesn’t want to allow competition for offering those features, but if it did, competitors may use that access to local data to exfiltrate.

So it is about both competition and, as a result of creating competition, privacy.

alt227 | root | parent | next
Thats what Apple wants you to think. In reality it has nothing to do with privacy. Apple could let 3rd parties tap into these APIs but only after the user clicks away a big scary message telling the user they are leaving the comfort of the apple curated garden.

This allows competition, but also allows privacy for those who want it. See? Simple really, but Apple being Apple dont want to let 3rd parties use its AI APIs and so we have this standoff.

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FinnKuhn | root | parent | next
Apple is using Cloud compute as well to enable Siri AI.

If you want to you could still use Apple or another provider you decide to trust - or even one that does everything locally. The competition would still have to follow GDPR after all.

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flopbob | root | parent
This is mostly wrong. The DMA has a process to determine if a service provider acts a gatekeeper to the market, and let's be honest if Apple is not one, then I don't know who else besides Google.. So there is no privacy argument in there except Apple didn't want to design a interface that complies and is safe.
crimsontech | root | parent | next
Siri AI has the capability to read your screen and access a lot of personal stuff. I don't blame Apple for not wanting to open this up to allow any model to access it. It seems Apple proposed a number of solutions which were denied.

While I can appreciate the reason for the DMA, people don't have to buy Apple devices, they can buy any type of phone they want and just use the ecosystems provided by these phones.

matchbok3 | root | parent
We already have choice - people can buy many different types of phones. Nothing about this is about choice or the free market. They want special treatment.

Apple is free to do what they want. The EU can go and try and build their own iPhone (good luck with that).

FinnKuhn | root | parent | next
> We already have choice - people can buy many different types of phones.

Do you really? The only two types of operating systems for phones that you could reasonably use are iOS and Android. So it's either Apple or Google.

Imagine a world, in which you could only consume Apple or Google services on those phones. No more Netflix or Disney+ on iPhones - only Apple TV Plus because the streaming video API is not available to third party apps. I think there are plenty of other examples to demonstrate the point.

A free market doesn't work if you have a duopoly. A free market requires the freedom to choose between different services, which Apple is trying to limit by only allowing Siri AI to access specific OS interfaces.

Not sure why some people on hackernews support more locked down operating system.

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f6v | root | parent
The EU is going to be China minus the technology.
seanmcdirmid | parent | next
Why is everyone conflating GDPR with DMA? DMA is literally the anti-thesis of GDPR in that, by design, it makes the ecosystem less secure, not more.
nonethewiser | parent | next
Why would the EU want an EU company to make a phone OS with a massive privacy flaw?
spiderfarmer | parent | next
If they can comply with China’s unreasonable demands, they can comply with the completely reasonable EU demands.

They already claim to care about your freedom and privacy. Now they can prove it.

kyralis | root | parent | next
It's not launching in China either.
frizlab | root | parent | next
They are not complying with China’s demand either AFAIK.
geodel | root | parent
First they are not complying in China. Second it is sheer arrogance if not outright racist crap that China's demands are unreasonable but EU's reasonable.

Seriously EU folks need to come to down to earth sometime.

seanmcdirmid | root | parent
I would venture that Apple is going to go with something fairly different in China with Chinese partners. This is different from 3rd party access because they aren't opening up their phones, it will just be a fixed 2nd party solution (like they do with Google, except Google -> Alibaba, Google Cloud -> Shanghai Water corporation or something like that).
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