Hacker News new | past | comments | ask | show | jobs | submit
stuaxo | on: DOGE has 'god mode' access to government data
They will have had to impose this too.

The systems were built as separate systems to avoid (in a systems designers most fevered nightmares) a scenario like this.

loading story #43113356
scarab92 | parent
[flagged]
bootsmann | root | parent | next
In clearance there is the concept of classification by compilation, which means that the clearance required for a piece of information can be higher than the one required by any single component that makes up that information. Being able to combine data across agencies makes it much more dangerous than keeping it separate and compartmentalized. Parallelism is a gigantic risk from a security perspective and ripe for abuse, especially given that DOGE itself has flaunted court orders trying to hold it accountable.
noja | root | parent | next
The organisations were designed to be separate, and the systems design follows that.
scarab92 | root | parent
Not really, agencies are merged and split and have their remit changed all the time.

If there were a way to efficiently manage 2.5 million staff in a single department, then we'd likely do that, but it's more efficient to specialise, so we do that instead.

Firewalling data between departments is rarely a design consideration, except in obvious cases (military), and it hardly matters in this scenario anyway, because it's not like Musk is walking into all 400 agencies with a laptop. DOGE is hiring an army of advisors and dividing them up between agencies.

l33tman | root | parent | next
I don't know about the US but in other countries it is definitely by design that the departments and their data are separate. It is far too easy to abuse gathering and joining data on people otherwise. History did teach us these lessons, and it's continuously visible as well today, fortunately at small scales just because they are separate.

It would truly be a nightmare scenario to have all government databases under a single potentially corrupt roof or having someone with access to all of them cough.

intended | root | parent
I believe Americans would be terrified of the idea of government agencies linking all their information together. Letting them be siloed is quite likely intentional.

You seem to be making the analysis based on first principles, but it looks like it’s inspired by some facts or experience you have. could you share that source /info?

| root | parent | next
{"deleted":true,"id":43112898,"parent":43112693,"time":1740045137,"type":"comment"}
DonHopkins | root | parent | next
So cooking the books and defrauding the citizens of the United States by exaggerating your progress by x1000 is crucial, you mean.

https://www.nytimes.com/2025/02/18/upshot/doge-contracts-mus...

DOGE Claimed It Saved $8 Billion in One Contract. It Was Actually $8 Million.

The biggest single line item on the website of Elon Musk’s cost-cutting team included a big error.

https://www.msn.com/en-us/money/companies/musk-s-doge-accuse...

Musk's DOGE Accused of 'Cooking the Books' After $8 Billion Savings Is Immediately Debunked

Elon Musk's Department of Government Efficiency (DOGE) falsely claimed an $8 billion cost savings from a canceled government contract, which was later revealed to be worth only $8 million.

https://x.com/electricfutures/status/1891898336208105676

Momentum Chaser @electricfutures

After several delays, @DOGE has finally posted its purported savings. Why did it take so long to create a simple webpage with a 1000-row table? Who knows! Let's dig in.

Headline number: $55B saved. They list the savings per nixed contract. This should be easy to verify then. [...]

guelo | root | parent | next
I can't believe people believe that it's actually an "audit". Both Trump. and Elon are famous liars. The reality is they think they found a loophole to destroy the government without having to pass any laws by fiting as many people as they can and stopping payments randomly. It's all illegal and evil.
briandear | root | parent
Have you read Article II?
bonzini | root | parent
Have you read Marbury v. Madison?
junon | root | parent | next
> It's just the default nature of systems that were created by different agencies, under different projects with different teams.

... Yes, because those teams by default do not simply get to share access, because of various very well understood security and privacy issues by doing so.

> Trump only granted DOGE a 12 month window to eliminate waste, and there's 400 federal agencies, so parallelism is crucial.

That's what he says, at least. Also, if their current blatant lying[0] about the """waste""" continues then I don't really see a point. It seems clear Musk and the Breakfast Club boys who are unilaterally changing government finances have no idea how a government contract works (or it's willful ignorance).

[0] https://x.com/electricfutures/status/1891898336208105676

jonahbenton | root | parent
None of what you are saying is true.