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lynx23 | on: #42059459
We're using abortion as birth control, in at least 90% of the cases, if not more. Because we dont want to tell the people involved that they have responsibilities in life, and if they dont want children, they are supposed to keep their legs closed or use some other form of birth control. The motivation is clear, its a convenience. But morally, its absolutely evil. I used to see it differently, but that was for my own convenience. Because I secretly hoped that if I ever accidentally knock a women up, I could avoid my responsibility if she is willing to abort. 20 years later, I realize its my responsibility, and I cant make a doctor kill a human being just because I would like to have an easy life.
ben_w | parent | next
> But morally, its absolutely evil.

At what level of development is a human foetus anatomically distinguishable from a cow foetus?

There's no fact-based reason to draw the line in any particular place. We, humanity, don't know what "personhood" really is beyond the laws we write while guessing and the just-so stories we tell each other to justify those laws.

That's why I'm vegetarian, and why I'd become vegan quickly as soon as someone can get milk from GM bacteria. (And sell it in supermarkets).

It's also one of two reasons why I try to be nice to LLMs: just in case. (The other reason takes it as read they have no experience of existence: by being trained on humans, they'll do better and worse exactly when real humans would do better and worse, and that means worse on holiday season and when getting insulted).

ruthmarx | root | parent
> We, humanity, don't know what "personhood" really is

It's self-awareness, at least in general and as considered by a court when granting it to a chimp.

It's also why I would likely never go vegan, although I do advocate for a drastic overhaul of animal welfare standards.

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leptons | parent
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lynx23 | root | parent
No, thats not what I said, and you know that. I believe we are using abortion to a very high degree for basic birth control. I am aware that there are exceptions, like those you mentioned. However, while necessary, these exceptions also pose a threat. Because if we have abortion legisation which only allows for abortions in cases of rape, millions of women will, out of desperation, start to claim rapes which never happened. Its a bad situation, no matter what we do.